Case Fright

Moderator: Larry Jowdy

Case Fright

Postby RVosari » Sun Dec 01, 2019 3:36 pm

An old line A&P mechanic acquaintance decided to rebuild his near 1800cc beetle a few months ago. He was quite reluctant to crack the case, so he replaced just the cylinder/piston assembly and R&R’d the cylinder heads.

I and others were adamant about “cracking the case” but he had a problem with a big Lycoming years back, and as he categorically stated…”all the oil analysis samples come back good…so no need to go in there and change the bearings etc.”

I saw him on Wednesday and he mentioned that cylinder pressures were un-even. I pointed out that deck heights were also
un-even and likely his CR varied from 7.9 to 8.3 to1. The motor runs OK, but it will never perform as well as new.

So if you find yourself with 40,000 + miles on a motor resist the temptation... and rebuild it correctly ! #-o

ReV
User avatar
RVosari
$$Donating Member$$
$$Donating Member$$
 
Posts: 340
Joined: Sun Jan 13, 2013 12:57 pm

Re: Case Fright

Postby RBP » Mon Dec 02, 2019 9:39 am

Thats interesting. I just did a top end rebuild on my 993 engine. I didn't split the case and I have 95,000 miles on the original motor. I rebuilt the heads and pulled the cans off for a good clean-up. I left the pistons and rods intact, replaced the rings. I have about 205# on all 6 cylinders. I can't find any info on what the compression should be. The main issue with these is cam timing. Hope I didn't make a mistake by not splitting the case.
Vintage, 2316 Type IV
User avatar
RBP
$$Donating Member$$
$$Donating Member$$
 
Posts: 1163
Joined: Sat Apr 08, 2006 6:45 am
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Re: Case Fright

Postby egrant5329 » Mon Dec 02, 2019 2:52 pm

ReV,
Who line bores VW cases in the North East these days? I assume if you split the case you should be prepared to have it line bored. I was down at Eastwood's Machine shop in Somers CT not long ago. The guy showed me a flathead engine that was just babbited and working on a Porsche 4 cam crankshaft, but his shop doesn't do VW line boring. The local machine shop up near me doesn't do it either.
EdG
Last edited by egrant5329 on Tue Dec 03, 2019 3:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
egrant5329
$$Donating Member$$
$$Donating Member$$
 
Posts: 1394
Joined: Thu Oct 09, 2003 5:14 pm
Location: New Hampshire

Re: Case Fright

Postby RS-60 mark » Tue Dec 03, 2019 1:26 pm

Why not just put it in a box and send it to: https://www.cbperformance.com/Machine-S ... -s/137.htm
User avatar
RS-60 mark
$$Donating Member$$
$$Donating Member$$
 
Posts: 2955
Joined: Wed Jan 23, 2002 12:00 am
Location: Windsor, California

Re: Case Fright

Postby egrant5329 » Tue Dec 03, 2019 3:27 pm

It would probably cost you 4 times what the work costs, just to ship it to California and back and add 2 weeks to the project. I bet someone in New England still does it, just a matter of tracking them down.
EdG
User avatar
egrant5329
$$Donating Member$$
$$Donating Member$$
 
Posts: 1394
Joined: Thu Oct 09, 2003 5:14 pm
Location: New Hampshire

Re: Case Fright

Postby RVosari » Tue Dec 03, 2019 8:12 pm

Ed,

I'll send you info on align boring cases etc.

My A&P guy did install brand new valve springs; set-up on his digital tester...I am sure it helps !

If your 993 motor runs well why go crazy...like the photo :(

ReV
Attachments
993 4cam+timing.jpg
993 4cam+timing.jpg (97.69 KiB) Viewed 239 times
User avatar
RVosari
$$Donating Member$$
$$Donating Member$$
 
Posts: 340
Joined: Sun Jan 13, 2013 12:57 pm

Re: Case Fright

Postby RBP » Wed Dec 04, 2019 6:28 am

Well, I didn't have anything that fancy looking. Just used a digital gauge and a solid lifter on the intake of #1 and #4 with .1 lash. If I remember it is set for 1.26 lift at TDC. Didn't check the exhaust since its the same cam.
Vintage, 2316 Type IV
User avatar
RBP
$$Donating Member$$
$$Donating Member$$
 
Posts: 1163
Joined: Sat Apr 08, 2006 6:45 am
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Re: Case Fright

Postby Larry Jowdy » Wed Dec 04, 2019 11:38 am

Back in the 70's and 80's I was building VW engines as a part time means of making more money. I'd pull 3 engines, rebuild them then re-install them the next week and then pull more engines and continue the cycle. When I wasn't doing that, I'd build hot rod engines for a dune buggy shop in Orange, Calif. I'd chrome them up, put them on an engine stand and he would sell them when someone ordered a frame.

I've probably built more than 300 engines over the years and in just about every case, I'd have the case aligned bored and use oversize bearings.

Interestingly enough, Gene Berg who was an arrogant SOB but very knowledgeable didn't recommend align boring because he said it lowered the oil pressure (even with a super duper oil pump) so, he always used a new case. In some instances he was correct but if the engine case was being rebuilt for the first time, I could usually get the case bored and have great oil pressure.
Larry Jowdy
Site Administrator
User avatar
Larry Jowdy
Site Admin/Owner
Site Admin/Owner
 
Posts: 8434
Joined: Sat Jun 14, 2003 11:00 pm
Location: Ontario, California USA

Re: Case Fright

Postby RVosari » Thu Dec 05, 2019 11:32 am

Ed,

As you can imagine many old-line machine shops in the North East working on air-cooled VW-dubs are gone...Bug City in Berlin, CT still has a machine shop ancillary at around $ 80./hour. I have never worked with them, so you would have to ask others...

Dave Carr (Autowerks) in Dunellen, NJ builds Formula -V motors...I have met him in years past but I have no idea what he charges !

ReV
User avatar
RVosari
$$Donating Member$$
$$Donating Member$$
 
Posts: 340
Joined: Sun Jan 13, 2013 12:57 pm

Re: Case Fright

Postby egrant5329 » Sun Dec 08, 2019 2:05 pm

I have purchased parts from Bug City over the years. I haven't spoken with them in a long while. They were always kind of "crotchety", but knowledgeable and helpful. Actually the few old VW guys I know are all that way.

I still can't believe cases are running ~$900 for an AS41 to ~$1200 for a CB super case. VW type-1 parts aren't all that cheap anymore. Heck you can pick up a pretty decent used 2.5L subaru engine for not much more than that.
EdG
User avatar
egrant5329
$$Donating Member$$
$$Donating Member$$
 
Posts: 1394
Joined: Thu Oct 09, 2003 5:14 pm
Location: New Hampshire

Re: Case Fright

Postby DannyP » Tue Dec 10, 2019 3:45 am

Ed, you might try Autocraft in Marlborough Mass. They have 35 years in business. That's where I got my dry sump pump and suction plate from. Nice people and awesome products!

I have no experience with their machine work but I have purchased parts from EVW parts in Severna Park, MD. They advertise everything from time certs to line bore and cam/lifter/crank clearancing.
2016 Vintage
User avatar
DannyP
$$Donating Member$$
$$Donating Member$$
 
Posts: 4297
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2001 11:00 pm
Location: Wallkill,NY,USA


Return to Tech General

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 8 guests

cron