Hello

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Hello

Postby Ray550 » Sun Jun 17, 2018 4:54 pm

Hi all. I've been a Spyder fan for a long time and the time might be right to finally take the plunge. I haven't rode/drove one before but I am pretty confident I am making the correct decision. They certainly look like a fun car.

I'm looking to build a reliable vehicle. I don't need a lot of power; I prefer the speed in the corners. At first I was thinking power with a Type 4 but I think a Type 1 will do. Now the Suby looks like a good option too. As with any new project where I know little about the work ahead, with the correct information, I hope to do the work correctly the first time.

I look forward to interacting with you all and hope to gain a bit of the knowledge available here.

Ray
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Re: Hello

Postby DannyP » Mon Jun 18, 2018 3:42 pm

The cars are so light(1500 pounds), a well built type 1 is plenty. At least mine is, at 172hp.
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Re: Hello

Postby EEricson » Mon Jun 18, 2018 5:05 pm

Welcome, Ray. I'm building one (https://alongcameaspyder.wordpress.com/) and will help any way I can.

I've ridden in Danny's car and it's very quick and fast. Remember, the originals had about 90 ft-lbs of torque (110 horses) and they topped out at about 135 mph. You don't need much power to have a lot of fun, but most guys nowadays shoot for between 140 and 200. That's a nicely-optioned and carefully assembled 2180cc (or 2110) Type 1, almost any over-two-liter Type 4 you're likely to acquire, or a bone-stock EJ22-25.

The Subaru engines are very nice and tend to have very wide, flat power curves. This makes the car either "extremely enjoyable" or "boring" to drive, depending on your point of view. Can't be beat for ease of maintenance though and, depending on the engine, you could boast having "a real four cam."

I love the Suby I put in Bridget, my MG TD tribute car, but it does take a little of the excitement away from the experience of long hills and tricky curves. The car just goes; doesn't care what gear it's in anymore.

I'm building the Spyder with a smallish (1914cc) Type 1, mainly because I got a pretty good deal on it. 120 horses at 5500-6000 rpm and about 125 ft-lbs at 4000 should move the car to 60 in about 5.5-6 seconds, which is about 2 seconds faster than the original item, and I think that's kind of a sweet spot. Racing the tuner boys light-to-light is beneath our dignity.

Have fun!
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Re: Hello

Postby danstern » Mon Jun 18, 2018 6:09 pm

Ray: Welcome! What's your location? If you're in SoCal you're welcome to a ride and discussion.
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Re: Hello

Postby Ray550 » Mon Jun 18, 2018 6:44 pm

Wow! Never though a 165hp Suby Spyder be boring! I agree having to working/downshifting to stay in the powerband has a certain amount of enjoyment when you get it right. Nice blog too EErickson.

DannyP: 172 hp Type 1 sounds like heaven. I'll NEED to get the details of that motor sometime.

danstern: Thank you so much for the offer. I would definitely love to take you up on it but I'm up in Ontario, Canada. Maybe if I ever get down to SoCal again.

Many thanks for all the input.
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Re: Hello

Postby DannyP » Tue Jun 19, 2018 2:22 am

Ray, my motor is 2165cc, 9.8:1 compression with 1.5:1 roller-rockers. Weber 44 IDF, 1.5 qt. sump, external cooler with oil and fan thermostats, 911 shroud(the only actual Porsche parts of my build). 147 ft. lbs of torque at 3500 or 3800, I forget. I've got 42,000 miles on the engine.

There is a guy on here named RBP(Rudy) that lives in Ottawa. He has a black Vintage Spyder with a type4. He may be close?

If not, I'm in Hudson Valley, NY, about 6-7 hours drive from Toronto. You're welcome to check mine out.
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Re: Hello

Postby Armodilo » Tue Jun 19, 2018 2:26 am

Hey Ray,

I'm located just outside of Kitchener / Waterloo in Ontario. You're more than welcome to come to visit me sometime. I have a 1992 Beck with a 2276 Type 1. The car wasn't built by Chuck at the factory, rather a kit someone else put together so there's lots of stuff I've been sorting over the past year since acquiring it and many things I still want to change that should have been done better but it'll give you at least some perspective.

When I acquired the car it had a 1915cc in it that wasn't taken care of very well, so I opted for the 2276 (150 - 175hp) [external cooler, dual 44 IDFs, DTM shroud, etc.]. I don't drive like a maniac but the larger engine definitely makes the car 'come alive'.

Shoot me a PM.
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Re: Hello

Postby Ray550 » Tue Jun 19, 2018 5:16 pm

Hey DannyP, I'll have to create some time to check out your beast. Thanks for the offer.

Armodilo, I'll be there in 5 min? I'm just inside of Kitchener/Waterloo. PM on the way
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Re: Hello

Postby RBP » Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:45 am

Hi Ray, I'm in Ottawa so if you want to see what a type IV is like and don't mind a bit of a drive I'd be happy to take you out. Mine is a 2316, when purchased I was told about 200 HP and 200 ftlb of torque. I don't have actual dyno numbers so I likely have something less than that for power but close, most times people always over state HP & torque. I can tell you one thing, at WOT in 1st it feels like the front end is lifting off the ground. It has more than enough power to be scary, I wouldn't open the throttle going around a corner.

FYI, there are 2 schools of thought on building a 550. Some like to build and stay true to the original, they opt for the air cooled engine like the original. The other is to go with the water cooled Subie. Personally, I like the air cooled engines and there is no better sound!

You should consider contacting Tony in Waterloo. He has a Vintage 550 that he was building. He is now selling the project. Not sure if its still available but doesn't hurt to ask.
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Re: Hello

Postby Ray550 » Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:45 pm

Hi RPB, I have already talked to Tony. Yes he has a very nice build with a Subaru fitted and I tried, but couldn't convince myself that was the way I wanted to go. Still working on it.

Those 2 schools are exactly my debate. I'm looking at the pros and cons of each, along with what is involved with the build, time and reliability as well as costs. One of the big items I should consider is the experience and since I don't have anything to compare, I certainly appreciate your offer for a ride. Typically I haven't had/didn't need a lot of power as I can scare myself in the corners if I really want, but then again, I may also really like the power once I have it. So the debate continues...

Thanks for your input
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Re: Hello

Postby Ralphc » Thu Jun 21, 2018 6:24 pm

Air cooled will up the amount of maintenance required, unless you do electronic ignition and fuel injection. Periodic valve adjustments would be required with air cooled in any event.
But regardless of engine this is NOT a set it and forget it car. You need to inspect everything regularly: clean, adjust, tighten, lubricate and etc., whether VW or Subie power. Inspect & maintain as if it were a ground-bound aircraft. It really helps to learn the basics and do them yourself, especially if you elect air cooled with carbs, regardless of ignition.
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Re: Hello

Postby RBP » Fri Jun 22, 2018 4:53 am

Ralph is right,these cars are not just drive and forget, they require a fair bit of intervention on our part. Most of us are very good at this, some much better than others.

As for me I love the simplicity of the air cooled engine. There are no electronic modules or software I need to worry about. The aircooled engines are bullet proof once you configure them and understand some basic things. Just swap the ignition for the crank trigger setup like Danny has, learn about how the weber carbs work and how to tune them and you'll be set. Doesn't get any more simple than this engine! As far as reliability I can only say I trust mine, its very reliable.
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Re: Hello

Postby Ray550 » Fri Jun 22, 2018 5:08 pm

Ralph, I was planning to (learn and) do the maintenance myself, that's half the fun. Electronic ignition, definitely(not a fan of points). Fuel injection, maybe, but I was hoping to use a pair of Mikuni DCOEs left over from another project. I haven't set up a carb in quite a few years so I will have to refresh my memory (and find my flowmeter). Setting valve lash, done before. Blue loctite generally helps random items from coming loose. General maintenance is not a problem but reminder to self to add to reading list:
-Maintenance schedule
-Fuel injection options
-Mikunis on VW, what is required?

RBP, I believe "old school analog" carbs or fuel injection may or may not be reliable depending on how they are set up. However, I am comfortable with electronics/software AND carbs so it will probably come down to, (assuming I go air cooled): carbs if I can use mine at a reasonable price. If not, I would probably go fuel injection. I WILL give carbs the advantage in sound though and I'd love to hear your Webers at "capacity."
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Re: Hello

Postby EEricson » Fri Jun 22, 2018 6:18 pm

Mikunis...these are side draft carbs?

If so you should probably rethink.
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Re: Hello

Postby Ray550 » Fri Jun 22, 2018 7:50 pm

Yes, sidedrafts. Did some reading and there are the wrong type of carbs for the application so yes, rethinking. Much more reading to go...
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