Waiting on Last Parts from Vintage

[Kreutz]

I have run out of ideas on how else to address this issue, so I am resorting to a public forum...

I am the proud owner of a partially complete Vintage spyder. I ordered my car on April 16, 2009, after a lot of research. I saw the pluses and minuses of a number of the vendors, liked the design / workmanship of the Vintage product, and decided since I was living in the LA area at the time, I could manage any delivery challenges along the way. I mentioned to Greg that I had seen a lot of comments on great quality, but also comments on issues with delivering on promised timing. I asked him what he needed in a customer in order to avoid those issues. He told me don't change your mind through the process. So I worked very hard to make sure we settled on the options, and if there were adjustments (base on his honestly great suggestions), I talked in detail with Greg over those changes.

Things went pretty well at the start.Through the summer, a discussion on this site lead to the guys at Vintage modifying the rear clam shell molds on my car (I followed up on one of Greg's posts here about possibly taking on the challenge with one of the cars he was working on). I'm very pleased with the work, and love the look of the "more correct" rear end.

I took delivery of the car on May 15, 2010, but there were a few things missing:

Roll Hoop and cross member (powder coat on these pieces wasn't right - Greg said he'd have it re-done)
Spyder emblems
914 refaced gages and aluminum backplate (part of one of my pre-delivery payments was to procure the 914 donors)
Throttle Cable
Header tubes for dual mangaflow type IV exhaust
Tan leather bonnet straps

Greg said he'd have these parts delivered about a week later, and we settled on an amount of money I still owed for these outstanding parts, but it was less than it would cost me to resource these parts from other suppliers.

A month before delivery, I moved to Texas. Since delivery, Greg has talked to me only twice, and emailed once. I have called and called, left voice mail messages, personal messages, text messages and emails. I have traveled to the LA area on business twice, and tried to coordinate a visit. My pregnant wife even called and pleaded that I am trying to finish the car before our third child arrives, and I need these parts. All to no avail, and most without any response.

The only action I have seen to be somewhat successful for people in a similar situation is to post here, and then, at some point, Greg may respond.

So, here's my last-ditch effort. The experience was really great up until I moved away and couldn't randomly pop-in.

My recommendation to anyone contemplating a build is to be sure you can stop in at Vintage on a regular basis to keep things moving. It seems the saying, "out of site, out of mind" is fitting...



Mark

[YamaBice]

Oh no, not this again.

You know, there's always the option of not dealing with Vintage at all in the first place, given that there's an established history of problems in dealing with this particular vendor. There are certainly a lot of red flags that have been posted in this regard.

[RS-60 mark]

[Kreutz]

I agree Mark, I got pretty much what I had expected. After researching both the negative and positive comments regarding Vintage (remember, it's not all negative), and given that when I placed my order I was in the LA area, and expected to be there through the build, I had my risk-mitigation plan - show up at Greg's shop in person to move things along. This actually worked pretty well while I was in the area. With my change of location, I could no longer "pop-in" unannounced, catch Greg face-to-face, and get some attention.

The only other route I have seen some people move the ball forward remotely has been to make a public declaration of their disappointment on this forum, and eventually, Greg may respond. That's the behavior he seems to be training his customers to engage in, so I'm trying that route.

Thanks for the straight-forward response, but I'm not looking for sympathy or even commiseration. My goal in posting here is twofold:

1) share my experience (what has worked, and what has not worked) for other's benefit in an honest and fact-based manner.
2) trying to use my last option of a communication channel with Greg to see if I can get resolution.

[RS-60 mark]

[albaran]

When I was in the process of buying my Spyder, my wife had to go on a business trip to California (we live in Connecticut). I went along with her and visiited all three suppliers, Vintage, Thunder Ranch, and Beck who then still had a faciliy in California. When I was at Vintage I bought a part that I didn't want to take back on the plane so I asked him to ship it to me. It took forever to get the part after numerous phone calls, etc. It was obvious that if it was this much trouble to get him to hand something to the UPS guy who probably shows up every day, I would hate to think what getting an entire car would be like. Because I wanted a basic body and frame so I could finish it myself, I bought it from Thunder Ranch who delivered it in 60 days as promised and emailed me pictures during the building process.
These guys operate on a hand to mouth basis so I would be very hesitant to give them money up front for something that might happen a year from now.

[daVinci 550]

Mark,

Sorry to hear you are having difficulty getting your parts. I too purchased a Vintage, it took a little longer than I would have preferred, but the finished product was just what I was looking for. I also had a few remaining items that Greg later shipped to me, again, took a little while, (maybe about a month) but I got 'em. I am very pleased with the finished product.

Unfortunately, I live about as far from Vintage as you can get, and didn't have the opportunity to visit the shop.

[Kreutz]

Glad you got your parts Matthew. I'm also really pleased with the car, and am getting close to getting mine running - trying to finish the major work before my wife delivers our 3rd kid!

It definitely seems like it's a roll of the dice with customer service at Vintage...

Mark

[sjgharib]

Everything I've bought from Vintage via Ebay is as promised and shipped promptly.
So perhaps the trick is to request a part via Ebay and buy it there??

[daVinci 550]

- trying to finish the major work before my wife delivers our 3rd kid!
Mark

I purchased a rolling-kit and it took me roughly 6-7 years to complete and get on the road, a bit more than I anticipated, but I live on the east coast and had to purchase many parts on-line and wait for many items. I only had occasional weekend time to perform the work, but it was a fun hobby.

[DannyP]

Mark (Kreutz), I have a Vintage also and got a rolling kit in 2002. Almost all the promised(and paid for) stuff was there. I continually harassed Greg and finally got it all, but that was almost ten years ago. I absolutely love my finished product. It took me a few months to put it together, and about five years of little tweaks and adjustments to get it perfect. I feel your pain, as Greg makes a good product, but it can be very frustrating to get all the pieces. I didn't send the last half of the money until the car was ready and Intercity was on the way......22K and counting!

Since then, I have ordered turn signals, a trans strap, and the new style license light. All delivered in a very timely manner. BTW, anybody have an extra front turn lens, clear, repro style?

[Arch]

Mark, I feel so much better knowing that I at least got some sympathy from you during my travails with Vintage!

The real difficulty is of course not getting the Vintage product delivered when it was promised or even remotely close to the date promised, and added to that is that along with the long list of seriously irritated Vintage customers there is a shorter list of folks who get their car or their parts really really fast - WTF?
For example Greenberg who built a really beautiful car up in Canada got his body and frame personally delivered into Oregon by Vintage within I think 6 months months of ordering and at the same time I had been waiting almost three years and had no frame and no body after having put a lot of money on the table at Vintage. I was not happy because order sequencing meant nothing - first is last and last is first, and giving a lot of money up front absolutely did not help, did not get returned phone calls and did nothing for the schedule.
So in the absence of a real customer service department at Vintage the question a prospective buyer has to ask himself is "How is Vintage going to treat me"? It seems but a roll of the dice, but I expect there are more complex machinations that take place in the brain of the man running Vintage that makes one mans project a top priority while another mans project fades to black on the schedule. One thing is certain, Vintage is not run like a conventional business and I know from painful experience that if you are in the "fade to black" category of Vintage customer then the adage "out of sight = out of mind" is absolutely the rule that applies to you.

[Kreutz]

It does seem to be an experience that "bonds" many of us together!

[Greenberg]

I seemed to hit Greg at a brief moment when he was in need for cash and selling me a body and frame filled a need. I shot down to Redding California which was a hell of a over night trip and back. Greg is a sh*tty businessman and he is the first to admit it. Not an excuse, but definitely a reality.

I wish you only the very best in securing the balance of your parts.

[DannyP]

I wish you all the very best also!

I re-read my post, and 22K means miles, not dollars! It doesn't seem very clear in the first post.